With all of the black-and-white moralizing in our world today, we decided to bring back an old show from 2011 about the little bit of bad that's in all of us...and the little bit of really, really bad that's in some of us.
Cruelty, violence, badness... in this episode we begin with a chilling statistic: 91% of men, and 84% of women, have fantasized about killing someone. We take a look at one particular fantasy lurking behind these numbers, and wonder what this shadow world might tell us about ourselves and our neighbors. Then, we reconsider what Stanley Milgram's famous experiment really revealed about human nature (it's both better and worse than we thought). Next, we meet a man who scrambles our notions of good and evil: chemist Fritz Haber, who won a Nobel Prize in 1918...around the same time officials in the US were calling him a war criminal. And we end with the story of a man who chased one of the most prolific serial killers in US history, then got a chance to ask him the question that had haunted him for years: why?
EPISODE CREDITS:
Reported by - Pat Walters and Latif Nasser
Produced by - Pat Watlers
with help from - Carter Hodge.
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Great. Then depressed. Then great again. Stephen Dubner gets the full story from David Lang; we also hear from some fans, and the New York Philharmonic’s president. The math and the aftermath of wealth of nations. (Part two of a series.)
SOURCES:
David Lang, composer and professor at the Yale School of Music.
Matías Tarnopolsky, president and C.E.O. of the New York Philharmonic.
RESOURCES:
"Finally, an Opera About Economics," by Stacey Vanek Smith (Bloomberg, 2026).
"The Little Match Girl Passion," by David Lang (2023).
The Wealth of Nations, by Adam Smith (1776).
EXTRAS:
"David Lang’s the wealth of nations," series by Freakonomics Radio (2026).
"In Search of the Real Adam Smith," series by Freakonomics Radio (2022).
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First up on the podcast, along Brazil’s Juruá River, local residents have been working with scientists to manage a giant fish called the arapaima—affecting the land, the people, and the economy. Contributing Correspondent Warren Cornwall joins host Sarah Crespi to talk about this collaborative effort.
Next on the show, how moonlight affects nocturnal animals. Carlos Camacho, a researcher at the Doñana Biological Station, talks about the Moon-inflected habits of a nighttime foraging bird, the red-necked nightjar. His team found that the extra light provided by the full Moon allows these birds to consume more insects at night. And the timing of their long-haul migration between Europe and Africa is linked to the cycles of the Moon.
Last up this week, Science Editor-in-Chief Holden Thorp talks with Timothy Snyder, historian and author of the book On Tyranny: Twenty Lessons from the Twentieth Century. They discuss the role of institutions, professional ethics, and personal beliefs for scientists in tough political times.
This week’s episode was produced with help from Podigy.
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Economists and politicians have turned him into a mascot for free-market ideology. Some on the left say the right has badly misread him. In this updated replay of a 2022 episode, we hold a very Smithy tug of war.
SOURCES:
Eamonn Butler, co-founder and director of the Adam Smith Institute.
Glory Liu, a political scientist and Adam Smith scholar at Georgetown University.
Mariana Mazzucato, professor in the economics of innovation and public value at University College London.
Dennis Rasmussen, a professor of political science at Syracuse University.
Russ Roberts, president of Shalem College in in Jerusalem; host of the EconTalk podcast; and author.
Craig Smith, Adam Smith Senior Lecturer in the Scottish Enlightenment at the University of Glasgow.
RESOURCES:
Adam Smith’s America: How a Scottish Philosopher Became an Icon of American Capitalism, by Gloria Liu (2022).
"Henry and Adam: A Deep and Special Friendship," by Benny Higgins (Adam Smith Panmure House Perspective, 2020).
"Rescuing Adam Smith From Myth and Misrepresentation," (The Economist, 2018).
The Infidel and the Professor: David Hume, Adam Smith, and the Friendship That Shaped Modern Thought, by Dennis C. Rasmussen (2017).
How Adam Smith Can Change Your Life: An Unexpected Guide to Human Nature and Happiness, by Russ Roberts (2014).
"British Privatization — Taking Capitalism to the People," by John Moore (Harvard Business Review, 1992).
Free to Choose: A Personal Statement, by Milton Friedman and Rose Friedman (1990).
The Essential Adam Smith, edited by Robert L. Heilbroner (1986).
An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations, by Adam Smith (1776).
The Theory of Moral Sentiments, by Adam Smith (1759).
EXTRAS:
"In Search of the Real Adam Smith," series by Freakonomics Radio (2022).
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Last week, we looked at the hidden beliefs that can leave us feeling stuck in life. This week, in the second part of our conversation with behavioral scientist Dave Evans, we talk about radical acceptance. Dave shares why accepting reality as it is can be so difficult — and why it's an essential first step in building a meaningful life. Then, in the latest installment of Your Questions Answered, psychologist Sarah Schnitker returns to answer listeners' questions about patience.
When something terrible happens in your life, are you destined to fall apart? In our latest YouTube video, we explore decades of research about how humans respond to grief, loss, and tragedy. Check it out, and subscribe so you don't miss any of our videos!
Episode illustration by Getty Images for Unsplash+ Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
This is the abbreviated version of Checkup's call-in where we ask whether a career in the trades, or a university degree is the way to go in 2026. The federal government wants to hire 100-thousand trades workers. Want some advice for the young person in your life? Our experts weigh-in on where the job market of tomorrow is headed.
The deadline to collect signatures has passed for the Stay Free Alberta petition. The leaders of the separatist movement say they have the support to force a referendum, but a court injunction may stop the process. Should Alberta hold a vote on separating from Canada? From separatists to federalists -- we hear the answer to that question from every possible perspective.
The federal government says it will hire 100-thousand tradespeople to help build it's promised infrastructure projects. Canadians are twice as likely to advise young people to go into the trades -- but is the right call? We'll hear the arguments for both, as well as the advice of a career councillor.
It was ten years ago this week that a wildfire started raging southwest of Fort McMurray, Alberta. It would lead the largest wildfire evacuation in Canadian history. On ICYMI, from Checkup's show on May 8th, 2016, we hear from two evacuees shortly after they left the their homes behind.
